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I just can't seem to get it right! Does anyone have any techniques in which i can get better symmetry? The problems begin with applying the papier mache to the positive template to build upon, but after a few days of drying and re-applying layers the mask contorts out of shape where the papier mache begins to dry, leaving very oddly shaped, unwarable masks to work with! It then takes a few days of re-carving and setting the mask to put it right. I think also my templates aren't symmetrical either! But then also when i'm vaguely happy with the foundation mask, the design work on top always takes forever to get both sides the same, some mistake always jumps out at me and i wonder how i ever missed it! Is it just something that you learn over time, to get an eye for symmetry or are there techniques to make the process a little more simple. Maybe i'm just over complicating the angles within the mask, should i start with simple designs and work up onto more complex ones?
Any help or advice would be much appreciated:)
Danny
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Hi Danny:
It seems to me that your masks shrink while drying. I wonder what type of papper and glue do you use and how do you aply it to the positiv. Maybe it would be better to work in a negative form.
About symmetry, it is not so easy to get a complete symmetry but on the other hand, I think an asymmetric mask is more interesting as long as it have some kind of balance. Our own faces are asymmetrical wich make them more interesting. I would recomend you to work in the other direction, to make your masks really asymetrical in porpouse. Transform your sins into virtues.
Good luck
Augusto. <br /><br /><br /><br /><em>edited by: cabrera, Sep 22, 2005 - 02:39 AM</em>
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Hey Cabrera!
Thank you for your reply it was much appreciated, i've been trying out your advice and producing the basic foundation of the mask from a negative mould, that seems to be working quite well! Problem is i'm fighting with the original design to be cast with symmetry, i know you're right that it would be more interesting to have it Asymmetrical, i think to a certain degree that's fine, but my masks aren't wearable because they don't fit out of symmetry. But they're getting better, i think i just have to get on with it. For a moment i was just hoping there might have been a technique you know, something that i'd missed! But i think it's just practise! All the same thank you for your help it was appreciated and applied:)
Oh, by the way i use Newspaper and the glue is just average PVA, and i apply it in cross-hatched layers of up to four or five layers on the first session.
Cheers again
Danny
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I use a similar technique to make prototype masks prior to moldmaking. I do a positive cast over a plasticine original using Celluclay. I get it as dry as possible before I pull it from the original by setting up a fan on it overnight. The drier it is when I pull it, the less likely it is to misbehave. After I pull the cast, I build on it at least partly with another kind of papier mache that has a higher content of plaster/pumice/fine particulate matter, such as Paperclay. This kind of papier mache is much less likely to warp and keeps the Celluclay parts somewhat in line. I use the Celluclay for the base, in spite of all its mischieviousness, because it is stronger and is more likely to come through the whole positive casting routine unscathed.
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Looking over your original post, my guess is that the PVA glue is re-softening and misbehaving when you put new layers of newspaper on. Is the mask on the template when you do this? If it's not, I would suggest trying putting it back on the template as you work it and as it dries, so there is something to help it keep its shape. You could also try using Sculpt and Coat instead of the PVA glue, as this will not resoften. On the positive side, Sculpt and Coat will make your masks really strong, on the negative side, they will become much harder to work.
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Okay, i'll definitely try your advice, it's much appreciated:) Now i can work on that, but just one more thing, how do you get symmetry on your prototypes? Without even thinking about warping and misbehaving as you'd put it? If you're sculpting the original positive in clay, how do you know that it's going to fit someones face? How do you know that the eyebrows are the right height and protrude equally etc, you know? Do you just get the hang of it? Get an eye for it i mean? It's just so time consuming, i've been spending months on this half face prototype and god! I just can't get it right, i'm getting there slowly i guess, but if every prototype takes this long i'm doomed i tell ya!! DOOMED!
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what kind of paper and glue do u people use?
i am confused with all this myself...
im trying to make a venetian long nose mask and im having problems.
i no nothing of mask making,i do what i can but i just dont know what the professional use and i would so like to know
and what is a positive?
i also find that for the public,it is hard to find the right answers and instructions can u please helip???
Rory X. McCartney
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you can always make a cast of a person's face first by using plaster bandages (first put plenty of vaseline or similar over the face to ensure it lifts off) If you then fill the holes and cast this in plaster of paris you have a base to build your clay positive from. WIth regard to the venetion long nose mask, I have tried this myself, and got a satisfactory result by creating a clay version over a cast of my face. The problem comes when trying to get your papier mache into the tip of the nose. To make this easier, when I cast the clay mask in plaster, I extended some clay from the bottom of the nose to prevent the plaster entirely encasing the tip of the nose. This means you have a 'hole' in your plaster cast which you can get your fingers in to ensrue you can get the papier mache in. You can either leave this open to ease removing the mask later and then simply papier mache over the hole, or build up your required layers and then put a layer over to seal it. I use watered down PVA which soaks better into the paper and I use either blotting paper or construction paper. These are like newspaper in that they are un-sized, but a bit stiffer so after 3 layers or so, the mask is quite stiff. A positive is for example a clay model of a mask. A negative would be a plaster cast of this. Hope this helps. Alan C
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As I understand it, most shrinkage takes place when there is too much moisture in the medium as it dries. (with pulp, squeeze out all the water for less shrinkage. With glues, dont use excessive amounts, skim off anything dripping from your paper when applying)
Also, ensure its COMPLETELY dried before adding additional coats, (if it is shrinkage contributing to the distortion and symmetry problems.)
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In Response to Danny & Rory. Hello there! Good suggestions everyone. Danny, I thought I'd add a few tips for face detail placement. Use a styrofoam head or neutral form to get the placement for eyes, nose and mouth, etc. Cover with cellophane first. Then add your strip mache and begin to stylize over the form. Build your shell first with drying between layers. Then go back and decide whether you want to build up or cut out an area. This is a good way to get experience, as there is no quick way to learn other than trial and error. If you already have the knack for sculpting and it is the media that you are having problems with, perhaps you may want to try a different mache media. I use Sta Flo Liquid Starch. There's nothing to mix or dilute. Last, but not least, you should definitely consider minimizing the saturation. Unless, of course, you want it to feel like stone, clay or plaster. If I am working on a long nose, for instance, I use dry, crumpled or twisted paper underneath. The same for raising areas. Once the mask dries, you can remove the excess paper from underneath. This keeps it very light. You can smooth over the rough spots with a dab of medium. Anyway, this helps avoid collapsing. Rory. The simplest way for me to describe to positive and negative is that it refers to the inside(underside)and the outside(top)of a form or mold. In other words you can build over a form or press into it. Pulp is used for pressing on the underside, but strip mache can also be pressed into place. Sometimes you will need a release agent. However, it is not necessary with some of the acrylic type neutral mask blanks. Hope this helps.  Rozani
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